Keep them out of the bullpen, please

By On August 3, 2011 · 11 Comments · In Roster Decisions

There’s been a lot of talk this week about six man rotations and the Yankees. It seems that the media, too, is whipping up the competition angle when it comes to Phil Hughes and Ivan Nova. If Joe Girardi doesn’t stick with the six man rotation, it would appear that one of Nova or Hughes will be headed to the bullpen or back to AAA Scranton. No matter who pitches better, I want neither pitcher to end up in the Yankee bullpen.

Putting one of them in the bullpen might be slightly better for the short term, but it will hurt the pitcher in the long term. In fact, I think we could argue that sending them to the bullpen won’t really help the team. With Rafael Soriano back and David Robertson beasting the American League, it’s unlikely that Hughes or Nova would get many shots at pitching meaningful innings.

Putting either pitcher in the bullpen would also curb the one thing both pitchers need to work on: mixing in their secondary offerings. When Ivan Nova has been at his most successful this year, it’s been when he’s thrown more pitches than just fastball/curveball. If he sticks to his two pitch approach, he gets hit harder the deeper the game goes. Put him in the bullpen and he’s not going to get much of a chance to work on his changeup and slider against real hitters. The same goes for Phil Hughes. It seems that each and every start, I beg him to throw more than just fastball/cutter. He’s been getting better about mixing the curveball, though we’re not seeing his changeup much.

Both Hughes and Nova have minor league options and if they can’t pitch well enough to stay in the Major League rotation, they need to be stashed away at AAA to not only allow them to keep working on their secondary offerings, but to act as insurance. I like Bartolo Colon and I like Freddy Garcia; what they’ve done for the Yankee rotation this year has been nothing short of outstanding. Who among us thought that they would put up a combined 5.5 fWAR this year? Still, there’s always a chance that one of them–most likely Colon–could break down. If the Yankees don’t have proper insurance in the minor leagues, they could be in trouble if a pitcher goes down. With Nova or Hughes in the pen, the Yankees would have to resort to dipping into the minors for lesser pitchers to take starts and when the season starts getting old like it is now, that’s a risky proposition. So, please, Yankees, make the right call here. If you decide to take one of these guys out of the rotation, please do the smart thing and send that pitcher to the minors.

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11 Responses to Keep them out of the bullpen, please

  1. Matt DiBari says:
    August 3, 2011 at 11:11 am

    Colon and Garcia are now so fragile they can hurt Cano? :)

    Reply
  2. Kevin Ocala, Fl says:
    August 3, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    Young pitchers have worked out of the bullpen for over a century now, still do, and still learn their craft and the ones that talented and healthy go on to have good/great careers. This idea that has formed in Yankeeland because of Joba Rules or Phil Hughes’ “regression” is the classic case of confusing cause with effect. Add in “Verducci’s Maxim” and we have ‘hyperbole-hypertension’. Matt, you seem to be a smart guy. Go back and you’ll see that a LOT of pitchers, even current ones have done bullpen duty and have had MLB success……….

    Reply
    • Matt Imbrogno says:
      August 3, 2011 at 4:25 pm

      I have no problem with guys breaking in via the bullpen, so long as it’s handled properly and a permanent move isn’t made prematurely. At this point, neither pitcher is at a point where he needs to be broken in or where being in the bullpen helps his development.

      Reply
  3. Ted Nelson says:
    August 3, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    I think it’s a very strong article and I tend to agree that AAA is preferable to BP given the circumstances, but I do think you’re overselling the case a little bit.

    As a long-man either could work on his secondary pitches both in BP sessions and multi-inning appearances against MLB hitters. He could be around MLB pitchers, coaches, and catchers. He could remain fairly stretched out through BP sessions. He could still work hard in the offseason.

    So while I would also say AAA is preferable, I think it’s a fairly marginal difference. If a guy has the work ethic and talent I think the results will tend to come regardless of circumstances and I don’t think relief work is necessarily that huge a difference from AAA starts.

    Reply
  4. Duh, Innings says:
    August 3, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    ‘Thing is one of the YES announcers said Hughes can’t be sent down to AAA, or is he wrong?

    If Hughes can’t be sent down, in fairness to him he has to remain in the rotation and Nova has to be sent down because Nova has options.

    If Hughes’ next two starts are stinkers, that’s 8 bad starts out of 10 and Nova has to replace him and Hughes has to go to the bullpen because he can’t be sent down. I wouldn’t want Hughes in the pen, but I wouldn’t want him messing up the Yanks as a starter either, it’s getting late.

    Here’s a thought: What if the Yanks sent Burnett to the pen? Yeah I know he’s making $16.5M this year, the same next and 2013, but so what? What if he sucks again and Nova spins a 7 IP 0-2 ER dandy? Burnett should be in the rotation because he makes $16.5M? Too bad if he doesn’t like the demotion. His lifetime record with the Yanks is two games under .500. He’s 8-9 this year and getting progressively worse. Yeah he has given the Yanks at least five innings every start this year, but they’re not quality for the most part or at least the last ten or so haven’t been although he has made some good ones. I totally agree with Kay and Flaherty that Burnett should not think in terms of giving the Yanks a chance to win everytime he starts, but think like the #2 he’s being paid to be. Maybe a demotion would be a wakeup call for Burnett.

    If the Yanks are best with a Sabathia/Garcia/Colon/Hughes/Nova rotation, they should go with that.

    Reply
  5. Duh, Innings says:
    August 3, 2011 at 1:35 pm

    Btw if Burnett sucks tonight, he should be on a short leash against the Angels his next turn 8/9 esp. if he draws Weaver or Haren (I’ve no idea what the Angels’ rotation for the series would be.) The Yanks have to take two of three or sweep against the Angels (game or three games gained) and can’t have Burnett messing up the Yanks chance to do that. Thankfully Garcia will start 8/10 and Sabathia will start 8/11.

    Reply
  6. shimig says:
    August 3, 2011 at 1:53 pm

    they dont HAVE to take two of three. if they go in with a 7 game lead and drop 2 of 3 they still have a 6 gm lead. fact is the yankees are not really in a pennant race and can afford to spend the rest of the season analyzing for the playoff roster. that said i would still prefer aj not making any starts in the playoffs.

    Reply
  7. bg90027 says:
    August 3, 2011 at 3:03 pm

    I’m not opposed to going with a six man rotation for a couple of turns through the rotation. The benefits include giving all the starters a little more rest, and getting a better look at both Hughes and Nova before making a decision. They have a big lead in the wildcard race and looking at the big picture I think its worth losing a CC start to give everyone a breather and get a longer look at Hughes and Nova.

    Let’s face it though, if both are pitching well enough and one loses his spot, it will be Hughes that stays in the rotation. In that case, send Nova to the minors and keep him stretched out. If Nova wins the spot, I’d probably put Hughes in the pen or even DL him again rather than send him to the minors. They could always still get Hughes regular work by taking out Garcia/Colon early to try to keep their innings down and if they need a spot starter Adam Warren or David Phelps are deserving of opportunities. I know Hughes has an option left but why burn it this late in the year when you don’t have to?

    Reply
  8. bornwithpinstripes says:
    August 3, 2011 at 6:28 pm

    great problem to have if hughes comes all the way back.. send nova down ,then for the playoffs load up, with nova, manny b. noesi,

    Reply

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