Get ready B-Jobbers, your prayers may soon be answered, just with a different highly touted Yankee Farmhand. For those of you who were opposed to the B-Jobbers, get ready to put your hand over your knee because it is about to jerk upward.
On today’s YES broadcast, David Cone and Paul O’Niell discussed extensively about the possibility of moving Hughes to the bullpen once Wang is ready. John Kruk also brought it up on ESPN. I assume that it wasn’t just idle speculation, but something they were already hearing being kicked around by the Yankee brass. They were certainly discussing it as a realistic possibility, and Coney (who’s a big fan of Hughes) recounted how he began his MLB career in and out of the bullpen for the first 3 season and how important that was for his development.
While I was firmly in the ‘Joba Starts’ camp, I would understand and support this move if it was to happen. It makes sense for the following reasons:
- We certainly need bullpen help right now. Nobody out there throws strikes on a regular basis and the guys we’ve brought up from AAA haven’t worked out. Hughes may still be learning the ropes on the MLB level, but he throws strikes. There’s no point having one of your best arms in AAA when the MLB club cant get outs in the late innings. This was the rationale used when Joba was called up to be a reliever, and it applies here as well.
- I have always felt that Phil’s main problem was simply building confidence. His last start was a great example of that, where he came out looking great and throwing strikes to the first three batters. Then Morneau hits the HR off a decent pitch, and he walks the next two batters and isn’t the same the rest of the game. Limiting his exposure and using him in spots where he will be successful will give him the MLB experience he needs and build his confidence, which will be good for Hughes long term development as a starter. Its been done many times with many starters, Chad Billingsley being a recent example. That Joba kid turned out pretty good as well.
- He has nothing left to prove at AAA. The things he needs to learn will only happen on the big league level, so sending him down does little to further his development. Its a waste of time for both Phil and the Yankees. All he would get out of it is innings, which can be addressed elsewhere. So again, its good for his long term development as a MLB starter.
- The farm exists to fill the needs of the MLB club. The MLB club is not there to develop players, it is there to win games. Especially a win-now team like the Yanks are. The Yankees aren’t there to serve Hughes and his needs, Phil is there to serve the needs of the team. I’ll guess that if you ask Phil, he’ll take a MLB bullpen role over another AAA assignment.
- I’m sure the Yanks share my view of Hughes as a starter long term, so if this move was made he would certainly not log enough innings this season. He’s at 36 IP right now, and Cashman says Wang will get another start in AAA, so lets call that 42 IP. Figure he would add another 50-60 as a reliever this year. Then he can pick up another 30 innings in the Arizona Fall League/Winter Ball as they did with him last year. That puts him at 120-130 for the season, which is more than enough to make him the 5th starter next year without any restrictions.
I know that sending starters to the bullpen has become a divisive issue among Yankee fans, engendering knee jerk reactions from both sides. I take these on a case by case basis, and I think it will be both good for the Yanks this season and good for Hughes’ development. And yes, as a starter.
[poll id="4"]
If you enjoyed this article, please consider sharing it!
0 Responses to Hughes to the Pen?
Leave a Reply
TIQ IQ
Here’s the question people, once Wang is ready.
Who do you want on the MLB roster, Phil Hughes or Brett Tomko?
You could also do ‘Phil Hughes or Jose Veras?’
Firstly, I’m pretty sure it was speculation on their part, or we would have heard something in the paper from “Yankee officials” by now. Secondly, the Yankees want Phil to get between 140-160 innings this season so he can get to 170-190 the following year, and be at 200 once he is ready to be a key part of the rotation. This plan would not serve that purpose. I think your logic is good, and if this was not a consideration they might do it, but I think the innings goal precludes it.
I think that Hughes should remain in the rotation until Wang fully regains his velocity. My learning over the last two years is that the gap between AAA and MLB is huge. The fact that Wang has had some good AAA starts is encouraging, but “touching 92″ (Eric’s article) is not. Let him keep getting healthier and stronger in AAA unless Hughes just really craps out. I don’t like the Hughes to the bullpen move. There is no guarantee that he will succeed in that role and, as Moshe points out, we need to get him innings as a starter — even if that means AAA.
“I think that Hughes should remain in the rotation until Wang fully regains his velocity.”
I agree with this statement 1000%. At 93-95 MPH with the 2 seamer, he’s Chien Ming Wang. At 88-90 MPH he’s Sidney Ponson. I’d rather see Hughes pitch than Sir Sidney part 2.
So far reports have him TOPPING OUT at 92, but sitting at 88-90 MPH. I let him stay down in AAA until he gets it going.
He has plenty left to prove at AAA, namely that he can command his pitches consistently game in and game out. All the talent in the world and I think he’s going to be a good one, but I would be very comfortable with them leaving him at AAA for another 10 or 15 starts and get him in a rhythm of throwing every five days and see if a stable environment helps breed consistent pitching.
I posted before Hughes came up that I thought he should have the full year to develop down below and I feel it was a mistake to bring him up before he is ready. I like Hughes a lot and feel he will be pretty good someday down the road when he can use all four pitches regularly.
My answer wasn’t there: BP and spot starts a la Tidrow/Mendoza. I have to believe they’re going to have Joba miss a start now and again, and Phil could take those. I think letting AP miss a start or three might be a good idea as well, and he could start those, too. Lastly, there are always make-up games crowding the schedule in August & September-again Phil cam start there.
He could move to the BP and still get 150 IP if used correctly. If you look at some of the guys learning the MLB ropes, a lot of them have 1-12 starts and 140-160 IP.
With this rotation, you would need to assume injuries for him to get enough innings. you cant plan like that.
To me what he needs more than anything else is a stable situation, where he can get into a routine of pitching every five days, side sessions, etc etc, and see if that sort of consistency manifests itself in his on-mound performance. Innings counts are important but to me what’s more important is trying to re-catch the sort of lightning in a bottle that had scouts drooling and Yankee fans thinking they were watching their future ace. If the difference between Hughes circa 2007 and Hughes circa 2009 is mostly mental I can’t see an erratic schedule, a Mendoza-like pattern of relief, long relief and spot starts, being very beneficial. Aceves, by contrast, seems like he would be perfect for that role.
I don’t think that moving Phil Hughes to the bullpen because he should be a starting pitcher. I think that the situation is different than Joba’s was for a multitude of reasons. Firstly, I’m pretty sure that Phil is no longer eligible to go to the Arizona Fall League like he did last year. Secondly, I think that Joba had a much better repertoire than Phil does at this point in his career. Phil needs to go down to Scranton and learn a fourth pitch. His cutter is a nice pitch to get lefties out, but I still feel that hitters have the ability to sit on his pitches. The last reason which makes me think Phil needs to go to Scranton is to build up innings. In the case of Joba, he was converted to a reliever once he was already almost at his inning cap at the end of the year. Last year he started off in the bullpen as an attempt by the Yankees to have him reach his limit at the end of the year. Unfortunately he got injured, but the whole reason he was moved to the bullpen was to preserve his arm. If the Yankees place Phil in the bullpen now he will not be able to reach more than 100 innings this year. I think that the Yankees plan has always been to have Petitte pitch for them this year and then to move Phil to the rotation next year. If Phil is unable to reach 160-180 innings this year, the Yankees would then be faced with the situation of having an innings cap on him like they have had with Joba. I think any move other than keeping Phil as a starter and moving him down to Scranton would be shortsighted. If Phil is around 150 innings by September I think that it would be okay to move him to the bullpen because than you won’t have to deal with inning limits. I also agree that it would help build Phil’s confidence if he pitches well.
“Firstly, I’m pretty sure that Phil is no longer eligible to go to the Arizona Fall League like he did last year. ”
I think that’s correct, but its irrelevant in any case. He can pitch in Puerto Rico instead of Arizona.
This is a hard one but, Phil in the pen sounds good to me. I have seen many pitchers spend more then one year in the pen before becoming very good starters.
AAA batters will swing (and miss) at pitches the big guys will hit a long way…what will he learn from it?
I realize innings are a big deal but, so is learning how to pitch in the big leagues. One must except the fact, he can make a perfect pitch and still have it hit out. I think the way he worked out of trouble a few times was a very good sign and showed his maturity is improving.
He can be used as a long man (more innings) and spot starter, let’s face it one or more of the guys will miss a start this year…also, there are make-up games along the way.
[...] Hughes to the Pen The Yankee Universe Posted by root 15 minutes ago (http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com) Reply to this comment steve reply may 18th 2009 at 19 21 important is trying to re catch the sort of lightning in a bottle that had scouts drooling if the difference between hughes circa 2007 and hughes circa 2009 is mostly mental i powered by wordpress a Discuss | Bury | News | Hughes to the Pen The Yankee Universe [...]